This suggests to me that they made several attempts to get the hardness right. Have you ever looked at an IP receiver? Most of the early ones that I've seen have multiple hardness test marks on the right side, rear of the receiver and on the bottom of the receiver. The fact is IP marked carbines are not that rare, certainly not as rare as most people are lead to believe and certainly not as rare as UN-Quality marked receivers. Why were their contracts not cancelled? IP's contract was different than all the other manufactures, which is why the government was looking for a way out of the IP contract well before IP was supposed to make their first delivery. So are we to believe roughly half of the IP marked carbines survived all those years and fell into the hands of collectors?Īs far as metallurgy problem goes, every manufacturer had issues and every manufacturer had receivers as well as completed carbines fail testing. Years ago the Carbine Club published they had just over 1200 IP marked receiver serial numbers reported. Underwood lineouts at 7,500? Larry puts the IP marked receivers at about 32,000+/. So if there were only between 2,000 - 3,542 receivers bearing the IP name per your original post then why in the list of rarest carbines of them all in War Baby II are Irwin Pedersen marked carbines ranked between Inland X suffix carbines, about 10,000, and Underwood S marked carbines, 50,000-? Shouldn't IP marked receivers be between Rock Ola / Inland lineouts at 1,990 and N.P.M. How many were marked Saginaw S'G'? It's likely very few if any were considering William Doerfner stated they used everything they could that IP left behind to get carbines delivered. Within weeks of taking over the Grand Rapids facility Saginaw Gear delivered almost 3000 carbines from GR with another 11,800 a month later. Neither are accurate as to how many receivers bar the IP name. So how many were there 3,542 or 3,200? You've quoted both numbers. IP had a metallurgy problem and those receivers not passing the hardness tests would have been scrapped plain and simple. "At the time of the takeover there were 3,200 completed carbines, plus an unknown number of receivers in various stages of manufacture." War Baby III with no mention of any rifles that were accepted by the Army. "By the time their contract terminated on Mathe Irwin Pedersen Arms Co had assembled 3,542 carbines, none of which had been accepted by the government." Larry Ruth, War Baby. In addition to the fully assembled carbines an unknown number of completed receivers, partially completed carbines, and the majority of parts necessary to complete the former IP contract were also on hand.Įducated estimates based on reported carbines bearing the IP name, the serial number span of those serial numbers, along with other pertinent data puts the number of carbines with the IP name at around 24,000. Saginaw Gear "inherited" 3,542 fully assembled carbines from Irwin Pederson when they assumed control of the Grand Rapidsįacility in April 1943. The stock was sanded at some time, however, the cartouches still show and I gave up trying to find a replacement years ago. 2ME, barrel band none, swivel KVS'G', butt plate PM-IP. My rifle SN1781229 has the following parts: bolt and firing pin S'G', slide S'G', hammer unmarked dogleg, trigger housing IP, mag catch B-IP, safety IP-W, sear SW-IP, trigger S'G', front sight IPN, rear sight BIP-R.side S- L.side, stock(high wood) boxed S'G',OC crossed canons on R side, IRIP in sling well, handguard IRIP, recoil plate IP-W, 2-43 Underwood barrel. The exact number of IP marked carbines re-built by Saginaw isn't really known but guesstimates of around 20 is generally accepted. Saginaw Steering and Gear Corp(GM) was offered the contract and they assumed operations of the plant in April 1st 1943 with approximately 3500 unfit IP carbines. Since they never produced one carbine that was accepted by the Ordnance Corps, their contract was cancelled. The story of the birth and death of IP is interesting.
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